[css-inline] alignment of initial-letter for South Asian scripts without hanging baseline #864
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https://w3c.github.io/ilreq/#h_initial_letter_styling has some information about that. In particular the subsection at https://w3c.github.io/ilreq/#h_scripts_without_hanging_baseline |
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Based on @r12a's references, it seems like the correct way to handle this would be to add a |
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Keep in mind the theoretical value model for |
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The CSS Working Group just discussed
The full IRC log of that discussion<fantasai> Topic: South Asian initial-letter-align<fantasai> github: https://github.com//issues/864 <fantasai> https://w3c.github.io/ilreq/#h_scripts_without_hanging_baseline <emilio> fantasai: in ^ we're not aligning ink-to-ink, we're aligning the top and bottom of the drop cap to the top and bottom half leading of the line <emilio> fantasai: proposal is to add a value that does that <emilio> fantasai: we have a value into text-edge for that called `leading`, which corresponds to that half-leading edge <emilio> fantasai: so proposal is to reuse that name <emilio> florian: this seems a reasonable solution to the problem, but I'm confused about the stated problem <emilio> ... half-leading is very css-y, it's interesting to see typography using it <myles> q+ <emilio> AmeliaBR: the diagrams don't seem to be talking about leading but about ascent and descent of the characters <emilio> fantasai: there's ascent and ascent height in the diagrams. One of those two is our ascent and the other is something else. <emilio> ... afaict our ascent is their ascent height <emilio> ... if you argue that our ascent is their ascent then what is their ascent height? <emilio> ... I'm pretty sure that what they're calling ascent is just the half-leading edge <emilio> myles: is this a proposal to change the meaning of different metrics depending on the font or is this about adding a value to a property? <emilio> fantasai: adding a value, to `initial-letter-align` <emilio> astearns: there are some questions about whether this value solves the issue, maybe we should push it to another level? <emilio> fantasai: we can go back to i18n and check whether it does but this is not a case of us not having a proper metric for this <florian> q+ <emilio> ... I think we should add it and check with i18n whether it solves their problem <emilio> myles: I don't want to weigh in about the particular metric, but can we have the behavior of auto to do the right thing? <myles> https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/initial-letter-align <emilio> fantasai: we don't have an auto value for this <emilio> myles: mdn says there's one (^^) <emilio> fantasai: really? <emilio> faceless2: I suggested adding one about 3 hours ago <astearns> ack florian <astearns> ack myles <emilio> myles: I guess I should rephrase: if this is the expected way to do type setting we should make sure that it does the right thing by default <faceless2> Bottom of https://github.com//issues/5244 <emilio> fantasai: yeah but we have another issue for that <emilio> myles: I'm fine with that <emilio> florian: this seems like the right way to do this if reality matches the diagram <florian> I'd support an inline issue or note calling for feedback <emilio> RESOLVED: add `leading` value to `initial-letter-align`, and get feedback to confirm it solves the issues for these scripts |
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I've been doing some testing with this one too, attempting to match the image from the ILREQ link above, which I'll paste here for clarity:
That's the goal, and some initial testing has given me this:
That's aligning the baseline of the initial-letter with the baseline of the second line of the paragraph, and the cap-height of the initial-letter to the leading-top of the paragraph (indicated by the top-most blue line). The alignment is significantly different because the top alignment point of the initial-letter is the cap-height. From the diagram, we'd need the top-alignment point to be the "dropcap median line". This is clearly not something that we can assume will align will the cap-height, and not an alignment point we can easily get from elsewhere. So while I'm in support of adding the "leading" option to |
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@faceless2 AFAICT the missing part of the solution is essentially needing to solve #5244 no? |
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@r12a Thanks for ILREQ! We've added a value to the spec that tries to reproduce the required behavior. Note that we are missing metrics for the initial letter's top/bottom edges itself -- that's #5244. So, assuming we can get the correct top/bottom metrics for the initial letter glyph itself, what we're adding here is a |
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@fantasai yes I agree. |
What is the proper alignment for South Asian scripts that do not have the explicit hanging baseline, such as Tamil or Telugu?
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