User talk:Latebird/Archive 2011

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Jingisukan

The song is clearly meant to spread the joy of Jingisukan to the world. Are you suggesting that someone has violated a copyright to post the video on youtube? Have you contacted the copyright holder to apprise them of this situation and to inquire whether their joyous song is meant to be shared? ChildofMidnight (talk) 23:34, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Do you have a statement of the authors about their intentions, or is this just your personal speculation? As of WP:BURDEN, it is your job to provide such evidence, not mine. --Latebird (talk) 00:28, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not hosting the song. So if you suspect a copyright violation and are concerned I think it is incumbent on you take appropriate action and notify the persons involved. ChildofMidnight (talk) 01:42, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Please study WP:ELNEVER very carefully. I've pointed it out to you before. --Latebird (talk) 09:33, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

It says "Knowingly directing others to material that violates copyright may be considered contributory infringement". I don't think that song is a copyright violation. Do you? Why? I think you should look into it. ChildofMidnight (talk) 05:48, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

Thank you

Hi Latebird! Thank you for your (comparatively) kind comment here... Actually, I have worked on Franco-Mongol stuff pretty much the same way I work on other subjects: I take a subject matter and try to document it as encyclopedically and in as much referenced detail as I can. That's not to say that the subject itself is especially significant historically: sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. One could argue that Hasekura Tsunenaga, another of the articles I created, is insignificant historically, but he is nonetheless so fascinating. You mention "perspective", but I'm certainly not trying to change historical perspective here: actually I think the Franco-Mongol alliance was rather insignificant and had almost no effect historically... but it is so fascinating nonetheless as an example of cultural interaction. I am not trying to "rewrite" history at all, but only to shed light on a rather dark corner of history. To me it is one of the beauty of a paperless encyclopedia that we can go into such detail for even very narrow subjects. Cheers PHG (talk) 18:40, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

PHG ArbCom request

I've posted a request for possible additional evidence at Wikipedia talk:Requests for arbitration/PHG/Evidence. Cool Hand Luke 18:48, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Inapropriate links???

Hi Latebird. I don't know which links are you talking about. If you mean the links of the miss world contestants, I think they make sense. If someone is looking for information of a Miss World contestant, he/she probably wants to see photos of her, and particularly photos of her in the Miss World competition. I have contributed with photos of all the participants of 2007 and 2008 to wikipedia. I have created the individual pages for most of the girls in 2008 and 2007. I don't make any profit with my website, I don't sell pictures. I actually provide the pictures free to any contestant that contacts me. I have a job as software developer, and I do the photography as a hobby. I can't see what is wrong with publishing photos of the girls in wikipedia, and linking to my site if the person wants to see more photos. Rosengurtt talk 19:12, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Please read WP:COI and WP:EL#ADV very carefully. You must never add links to your own site(s) to Wikipedia, because you are inherently biased to overestimate its usefulness. If it's really happens to be useful, then other people will add the links over time, and with a lot more credibility. --Latebird (talk) 00:53, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Byambyn Rinchen

Hi Latebird! I've just created an article on Rinchen, but I would prefer to have the picture that is in the Russian language article. Could you do me a favour and import it? G Purevdorj (talk) 11:28, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

That image on ruwiki seems to exist under a "fair use" clause. Since we already have an alternative one from the Commons, that isn't really an option here. Or is there evidence that it was created before 1972? Actually, the other one is also on thin ice in that regard... --Latebird (talk) 13:01, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

PHG case

I did a short review of some of your evidence at Wikipedia talk:Requests for arbitration/PHG/Evidence#Other evidence. Also note that I've posted a proposed decision, which is now in voting. Cool Hand Luke 16:20, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Your stubborness

Sorry but it has to be said from what I've seen of you Latebird, you are undoubtedly one of the most stubborn people I;ve ever encountered in my life. The word "fuddy duddy" springs to mind. User:Rarelibra has made a massive contribution to maps on wikipedia which generally look accurate and are of great importance on here. I do hope you have not scared him away from this site permanently with your response to him. You've let something you disagreed on with Mongolia affect the world contributions of an editor who is greatly needed on here. I;ve tried to reason with you in the past about opening up and allowing the Central Asian countries to have some sort of assessment too but you are too stubborn to "allow" us to try to improve coordination of this area. WHile seperate wikiporjects as yet may not be reasonable given the lack of major contributors, having a better assessment set up is greatly needed. Please be careful with the way you treat other editors in the future as some of them may be more valuable to the project than you might think. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 13:34, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Now if you cared to inform me what you're actually talking about, that would be most helpful. --Latebird (talk) 13:43, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Your disagreement with Rarelibra. I;m not saying there aren't two sides to every story but think of it like this, the guy is a professional map maker, he is a cartographer for a living. Telling him his maps are inaccurate, basically rubbish and representing false information is probably one of the hardest insults you can give him. If people are considering his maps inaccurate then he is going to think twice about creating anymore in case they are rejected. Naturally we want all maps to be as accurate as possible but were his maps really all that inaccurate?Were they really that bad? Could you provide an example and I might understand your side of it a little more. In my view district maps don't have to be 100% precise, I appreciate any maps of internal divisions which roughly help the reader if they didn't exist before. I just think you were a little harsh with him thats all, and am concerned he has not actively edited wiki since in two months. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 13:50, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

You don't really think that I was the agressive one in that discussion, do you? Unfortunately, the maps in question are full of very fundamental errors, and I see no good way to sugar-coat that. As far as I remember, only two of them even show the right number of sums. All interested parties (including him) have known this for a long time, related discussions go back about two years. After all, that was the primary reason why Bogomolov created the replacements currently in use. You can pick almost any pair between them for comparison to understand the problem. If Rarelibra is really unable to accept such straightforward and factual criticism, then I'll have to refuse responsibility for that. --Latebird (talk) 14:37, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Nope, indeed you seemed the calmer. I wonder what he was using to make so many errors.... Anyway thanks, I can see that it is more than just one or two that had faults and you were right to identify them. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 16:32, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

He mentioned at one time that he only had a small and unclear map, and needed to make many guesses about what it really meant to show.

Btw.: What does all of this have to do with article assessment? And on that topic, do you remember this little conversation we had a while ago? Such things are really up to the workgroup to decide, not me. --Latebird (talk) 17:37, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Please help with Mongol/Tatar invasions articles

Can you please discuss/help, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Mongol_Empire#Excellent_article_and_general_mongol_invasion_conquest_articles 97.118.116.250 (talk) 12:30, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Deletion of "Mongolia under Tang rule"

Hallo Latebird! Bitte schreib deine Meinung zu Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Mongolia_during_Tang_rule#Mongolia_during_Tang_rule! Ich halte die Löschung für unbedingt erforderlich, aber du kannst dir den Artikel und die Argumente ja selbst ankucken. G Purevdorj (talk) 09:58, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Hi

Good to see you back on Wikipedia. Gantuya eng (talk) 02:37, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

FYI

Deletion of Bilateral relation pages despite ongoing merging effort Ed Fitzgerald _{t / c} 08:38, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

And why are you canvassing this here? Articles without notable content must get deleted, after all. --Latebird (talk) 20:37, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Mongolian script

Hello, do you know of a computer program that will render soyonbo script? I found a badge that has Mongolyn Skautyn Kholboo written in it, so the text is used by Scouting, I need it. Thank you if you can help! Chris (クリス • フィッチュ) (talk) 16:57, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

There's a link at the bottom of Soyombo script, where you can download TTF fonts. I used those to create the example and symbol table graphics in the article. --Latebird (talk) 17:02, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

My mistake, I mean Mongolian script. Chris (クリス • フィッチュ) (talk) 17:29, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

There are also fonts for that one available (this time Unicode based). But they are only really usable with Windows Vista, because the character selection mechanisms are not very well designed in Unicode. It seems that User:Yaan has figured out how to use it, as he has uploaded many examples to Commons. Another possible alternative might be Menksoft IMEs, but I'm not sure how much you need to be familiar with Chinese word input methods to use that one. --Latebird (talk) 17:38, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

---

Menksoft Mongolian IME has an English interface, but sarcastically they didn't make an English installation program. Many Chinese softwares have that characterestic. --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) (talk) 09:34, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Ah, rats. Let me ask, if I send you a graphic of this badge, might you be able to help me recreate the text in Mongol script? Sorry to ask, but it's all I need it for. Thanks, Chris (クリス • フィッチュ) (talk) 12:08, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Actually, I haven't been successful with traditional Mongolian myself yet (don't have Vista). Better ask Yaan. --Latebird (talk) 20:53, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

You can download a "Vista IME migration to xp" and use it (not Menksoft, it's the Microsoft one, but without KB929763 support). See Mn:Хэрэглэгчийн яриа:虞海#87.184.97.23. --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) (talk) 09:08, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Reminder

Your comment is replied. --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) (talk) 09:34, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Menksoft and Menksoft Mongolian IME

FYI, as you have shown some interest in these pages, I have proposed Menksoft and Menksoft Mongolian IME for deletion as they are promotional articles for a non-notable company and software product, and I do not think they are appropriate for Wikipedia. Please seeWikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Menksoft. BabelStone (talk) 22:03, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Thank you

Thank you for saving the image of ger-tereg. Gantuya eng (talk) 02:41, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Carelessness with facts

Please do not add commentary or your own personal analysis to Wikipedia articles, as you did to Mongol invasion of Europe. Doing so violates Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy and breaches the formal tone expected in an encyclopedia. Thank you.

Don't throw your weight around, especially when you have no idea of the facts. The defeat at Klis fortress was not the first defeat of the mongols in Europe. Many fortresses in Poland and Hungary held out successfully against mongol seige tactics. The idea that only the great Croat army was able to defeat the mongols is nonsense and is pure revisionist history for nationalistic reasons. Please don't abuse wikipedia's warnings to defend that which is undefendable. I suggest you look at your own actions--I see a number of complaints against you here on your message board--before you make indefensible judgments. InFairness (talk) 15:57, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

Do you really think that mounting personal attacks against me strenghens your position? Retaliating by posting my own warning back onto my talk page is also considered very bad style. It would be much more convincing for you to produce reliable sources to justify your changes to that article. If you had done that, then such discussions would be unnecessary to begin with. --Latebird (talk) 16:17, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

Pax Mongolica

As you may be aware, Pax Mongolica article is being edited as part of this educational assignment. It will end with the articles undergoing a Good Article nomination and review processes. I appreciate your input so far; would you be willing to keep reviewing the changes to the article and help with the final review of the article for the Good Article status in the next few weeks? --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk} 20:08, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I'm aware of the context. That's why I try to explain my interventions there in more detail than I might otherwise do. I have most Mongolia-related articles on my watchlist anyway, so that I'm bound to notice any edits within a few days. I'll have to catch up on the formal criteria for GA nominations, though. --Latebird (talk) 15:15, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Correct translation for Russian titles

Dear Latebird, please see [1] Thanks, Barefact (talk) 20:24, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Dear Latebird, please see [2] Thanks,Barefact (talk) 10:30, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you, I appreciate it Barefact (talk) 18:01, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Khöshöö Tsaidam

Hi, I saw you did some stuff on the Khosho Tsaidam Monuments page. Do you think the two should be merged? What about the Tsaidam page - do you think it should be turned into a disambiguation? Tsaidam is some type of Mongolian landform, according to Vietze it is a word for salt marshes, according to this page it might also be some kind of wide valley or yet something else. I.e. there might be even more places with "Tsaidam" as part of their resp. names. Yaan (talk) 14:40, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

Is it Khöshöö Tsaidam that would be merged with Khosho Tsaidam Monuments? In its current state, the former might indeed be integrated without loss. Or is there more that can be said about the region other than "it exists"? To the very least the monuments article should be moved to the proper transcription. Right now there seem to be two places with "Tsaidam" in their names, so it's probably a bit early for a dab page. -Latebird (talk) 06:42, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

Fernsehen

Hi, ich wollte nur sagen, dass in der Nacht von Montag zu Dienstag auf 3sat Sturm über Asien läuft. Ich habe den Film vor ein paar Jahren gesehen und fand ihn ziemlich gut. Frohe Weihnachten,

Yaan (talk) 13:13, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Kombinat

Hi, google search seems to indicate that Mongolia has several places (and at least one citizen!) known as "Kombinat". I only have ever heard of Biokombinat, but I don't know where it is. Maybe if we ask Ganaa or someone else from UB we'd get the answer in no time? Yaan (talk) 14:15, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Actually, that Google search doesn't clearly indicate that there are relevant geographic places named that way. "Bio-Kombinat" and "Sükhbaatar Khevleliin Kombinat" etc. appear to be organisations, "Kombinat and Toilgoit districts of Ulaanbaatar" are at best Khoroos of Khan Uul Düüreg (if even that, since Khoroos are usually just numbered), and there are similar issues with the other results that I've looked at. Giving someone's birthplace as "Combinat, Mongolia" is therefore at best ambiguous, and meaningless without further clarification. Even if there is a Khoroo named "Kombinat", then that would probably be the industrial zone, a somewhat unlikely birthplace for not only one but two distinct national football players. But of course, if we find reliable information about what was really meant there, I'll be happy to see the details added. --Latebird (talk) 14:59, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

One of the older versions had Ulaanbaatar as his birthplace, maybe we could simply use that one. Yaan (talk) 15:16, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good. Btw.: Have you ever seen a list of all the Khoroos anywhere, especially those with names? --Latebird (talk) 15:22, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

No. Are those names really official names of khoroos, and not just inofficial names of some neighbourhood? Yaan (talk) 13:33, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Different names are possible in Mongolia, so Kombinat too. Originally Комбинат is a Russian word, it means an enterprise with numerous plants from the same branch of industry. Bogomolov.PL (talk) 19:15, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

... From the word "combination" ... or "combinato"...Gantuya eng (talk) 14:11, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

I wonder who would name his child Пулёмёт. Yaan (talk) 13:49, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Anyway, I'll add the link to the Mongolian name article. Yaan (talk) 18:12, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Could "Kombinat Nurahmet" be a misspelling of a Kazakh name? As an unofficial name of a neighbourhood, "Kombinat" is the area of those old shanty 2-floor apartment buildings to the west of the Khan-Uul Culture Palace (guess it's named like this) and to the south of the Chinggis Khaan Ave. Perhaps those buildings were intended for workers of factories. Some are like dormitories. As living area it perhaps stretches up to the Tsagaan Khaalga (Arch). There perhaps the former factories begin. Gantuya eng (talk) 14:11, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Misspelling is possible, but using Russian origin words as names (Пропуск, Чашка, Магазин, Пулёмёт and my frend met in Uvs Aimag a boy with the name Бурводстрой) is very possible. Bogomolov.PL (talk) 08:12, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

Showing a template by default

Kinda stupid question : at the bottom of Hurd's article, there are 2 templates : "Hurd" and "Mongolian pop and rock artists". Since there are 2 of them, they both appear collapsed by default. Is there a way of showing the first and collapsing the second, by default ? Or at least showing both ? Thanks. Lnemekhbayar (talk) 13:34, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

I've added some trickery to {{Hurd}} to pass the "state" variable through to the underlying {{Navbox}}. --Latebird (talk) 19:42, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Gee, thanks, never would have figured that out myself :) Lnemekhbayar (talk) 20:01, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

The trick is actually explained in the documentation of {{Navbox}}, and recommended specifically for this purpose. --Latebird (talk) 20:11, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Transliterating artist names

What should I do, when an artists "official" name in English is not how it is supposed to be transliterated ? For example, the correct transliteration of "Хурд" is "Khurd", but the band has always been known as "Hurd", even their official logo says "Hurd". The same goes for "Харанга" / "Haranga" / "Kharanga". Lnemekhbayar (talk) 12:14, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

If a band consistently publishes under one specific latin spelling (as is the case with Hurd), then use that self designation. We also have Camerton (band) where the transcription would be "Kamerton" and Kiwi (band) vs. "Kivi". You can expect that to happen sometimes with bands. It will only happen with individual artists when the person lives and works abroad and becomes well known there (can't think of a musician right now, but Galsan Tschinag is one such example in literature). --Latebird (talk) 17:39, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Should I move contents from "Kharanga" to "Haranga" and change the redirection also ? Thanks for your advice :) Lnemekhbayar (talk) 17:49, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

They seem to use "Haranga" on their own material, so I guess that would be ok. --Latebird (talk) 18:50, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Venue change

Since it appears that the AE thread was not the proper venue, the request for the extension of the topic ban on PHG has instead been filed here. You may wish to move your statement to that location, or if you give me your permission, I can handle it. --Elonka 07:39, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Done. --Latebird (talk) 18:31, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Esen taishi

There are different interpretation about "infidels" among Muslims. In reality there are many muslim names in his family before him, see http://www.surag.net/viewArticle.do?method=viewArticle&id=4a4f878f153bab8301154eb6c5040014 关于明代蒙古人的宗教信仰. It's unlikely he converted to another religion in order to marry a defeated leader's sister, see User talk:Enerelt. Sammyy85 (talk) 08:34, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

This kind of discussion belongs on the article talk page. --Latebird (talk) 21:18, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

On your "warning"

From october 2009: I have no idea what you're talking about. I added no personal commentary, unlike, probably, you. Go to hell.InFairness (talk) 02:17, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

Ah yes, and I'm also the one violating WP:CIVIL, right? --Latebird (talk) 16:27, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Deletion nomination of Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Mongolian passport

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Hi!

Hi, long time no see. :)

Do you happen to have any idea how one can create permanent links to the images in the French National Library? The links you and I found seem to require some cookie, if I am not mistaken. The link to http://mandragore.bnf.fr/jsp/switchExpert.jsp?division=Mix&desc=toghril.ong.khan&idDesc=11918 at File:Djengiz Khân et Toghril Ong Khan.jpeg seems to suggest something with ampersands and question marks should work, but so far I have been rather unsuccesful in finding out just what works. Yaan (talk) 12:40, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

I've also tried, but haven't found a really good solution. Javascript navigation on web sites is really a useability nightmare. --Latebird (talk) 08:21, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

About the Khalkha Picture

Hi, how are you doing today? Would you mind me explaining how I got the pictures? Please please please do not delete this picture, because this is certainly for educational purpose only. How many people do you see in Wikipedia who actually take their time and edit this article "Khalkha"? I am very much sure that no one does.

The first row: These pictures are coming from the State Archive of Mongolia. Anyone might upload it online, however, no one in Mongolia has the right to claim ownership over these photos. You can see these photos from many history books. These four people passed away long time ago and the actual people who have taken the photos were probably anonymous Russians or other foreign people who had cameras back then. I certainly think that I have a better right to upload their pictures, because as you can see my last name is Borjigin and they are from the Borjigin family as well. So, I would like to know what regulations you have when people upload their relatives' pictures. The third picture in the row was actually granted by his wife and daughter to me as a gift with the person's biography. Oh and although I did not scan the picture that I had at home, every single child of my grandfather's family has that first person's picture at their homes. Thus I have the right to upload the picture on Wikipedia, I believe, because the actual hard copy belongs to the family.

The second row: Mongolia does not have detailed Copyright Laws, therefore, pictures that were taken by Mongolian photographers are impossible to verify whether or they are copyrighted or not. Please let me know how are these other nationalities are uploading their representatives pictures? Why are theirs not being deleted? Must I have a permission from the actual photographer or am I supposed to take the pictures by myself?

The third row: The first lady is from my home province, Uvurkhangai Aimag, thus my family and her family are friends. I talk to her younger siblings regularly and I can assure you that the person on the photo would be more than happy to have her photo on Wikipedia as a Khalkha Mongolian. The fourth and the second pictures have been running on Mongolian websites and blogs for a long long time. It is like as if you type in "Orange" and find bunch of pictures of oranges. The third girl is a friend who used to do modeling when she was in Mongolia. She has recently quit the job and now resides in the USA.

The fourth row: The first picture has the similar story with the second row pictures. I really really would like to know which picture I can upload if I would like to have our sportsmen's pictures on Wikipedia? The second picture was on Mongolian websites for a long also and you cannot basically find who took it where it was uploaded and etc. Those type of information is really hard to get in Mongolia. Please understand the country's situation, it's not a European country, Canada, nor the USA. The last picture was luckily taken by a friend of mine.

So, please let me know before deleting the picture or I can get a deadline or something until I change some of the photos in the picture. I really want this article "Khalkha" to be improved and that's why I'm working on it. I would like people to open this page and say "Oh! So this is how Khalkha people are!".

Thank you,

Sincerely, —Preceding unsigned comment added by KherlenBorjigin (talk • contribs) 08:26, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Lord Borjigin! Please see the Mongolian Law on Copyrights: http://legalinfo.mn/insys/lawmain.php?vlawid=6237 Gantuya eng (talk) 09:51, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

You seem to be mistaken in two significant points: First, Mongolia has very clear laws on copyright. Second, for each individual work, Wikipedia must adhere to two different copyright legislations: The US one (because it's an US organisation) and the one where the work was first published. It is also a good idea for the uploader to respect the laws of the country where he or she is located. With the possible exception of the top row, all the images you used violate the law in all relevant jurisdictions. There is no way for Wikipedia to legally keep this. --Latebird (talk) 10:01, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

About the Khalkha Picture 2

First of all, I am new to Wikipedia and I do not owe anything to Wikipedia nor I have responsibilities for this company. As an administrator you should be respectful to the people who are willing to contribute to Wikipedia! I just asked your kind advice!!! I am not uploading this picture for personal pursuit. And please don't give me the fancy title "Lord!", because I am not a man. Keep your sarcasm to yourself please.

So how did the other nationalities upload their pictures? Like for example here: <<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazakhs>>. Or how did the previous pictures related to Mongolian articles were uploaded to Wikipedia? Do I have to be a government official to upload pictures on Wikipedia? <<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:People_of_the_United_States.jpg>> like on here, under which law or rules were they able to upload Oprah Winfrey's and Ellen DeGeneres's pictures? I am just asking your advice ok, because these two are recent pictures.

Row 1 is totally fine according to this-Quote: <<According to the Law of Mongolia on Copyright from September 1. 1993, amended February 1. 1997 and May 21. 1999, works first published in Mongolia are copyrighted for 50 years after the death of the creator (§§ 17, 2), 75 years after publication for anonymous and pseudonymous works (§§ 17, 3), 75 years after creation when created by a legal person (§§ 17, 4), and 25 years after creation for photographic works and works of applied art (§§ 17, 6) and then enter the public domain. The following works first published in Mongolia are in the public domain in both Mongolia and the USA: Any photographic image or other applied art created before 1972 (PD in Mongolia before 1997) Any pseudonymous work if it was published more than 75 years ago (Mongolian law) Any work by a legal person if it was created more than 75 years ago (Mongolian law) AND published before 1964 (US law, no renewal) Any other work if the creator(s) died more than 50 years ago (Mongolian law) AND it was published before 1964 (US law, no renewal)>>

Row 3-Photo #2 and Photo #4 are fine according to this law: 8 дугаар зүйл. Зохиогчийн эрхээр үл хамгаалах бүтээл 8.1. Дараахь бүтээлийг зохиогчийн эрхээр хамгаалахгүй: 8.1.1. хууль тогтоомж, эрх зүйн бусад акт; 8.1.2.захиргааны шийдвэр болон хуулийн этгээд, байгууллагын албан баримт бичиг; 8.1.3.шүүхийн шийдвэр, тогтоол, шүүгчийн захирамж болон бусад баримт бичиг, шүүх хуралдаан дээр хэлсэн үг; 8.1.4.энэ хуулийн 8.1.1-8.1.3-т заасан баримт бичгийн орчуулга; 8.1.5.төрийн бэлгэ тэмдэг, туг, далбаа, шагнал, одон, тэмдэг; 8.1.6.болсон үйл явдал, түүний үр дагавар болон тоо баримт бүхий сонордуулгын шинжтэй аливаа мэдээ, мэдээлэл; 8.1.7. ардын урлагийн бүтээл, үндэсний зан заншил; 8.1.8.аливаа санаа, үйл ажиллагааны арга, үйл ажиллагаа, шинжлэх ухааны нээлт, математикийн үзэл баримтлал.

I will change the pictures with non copyrighted images or I will find a way to get the permissions.

So one more question: Row 3-Photo #1 and #3: What if the people who are on the pictures will add you on Facebook and let you know that they are giving me the permission to upload their pictures on Wikipedia? Will it still be considered as copyright violation? —Preceding unsigned comment added by KherlenBorjigin (talk • contribs) 11:37, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Alright Lady Borjigin! Because of your extended discussion of your belonging to the royal family urges me to observe the etiquette of conversing with a noble person like Your Highness. Otherwise, a simple crude woman like myself will not be able to address Your Highness. Frankly, I'm given too much honour to talk with a descendant of Genghis Khan himself and I'm nervous-s!!

May I take your Royal attention to a point that Your Highness appear not the only editor who takes time to improve article Khalkha. If Your Highness hast a look at the history of edits of article Khalkha, then Your Highness would see that a lot of people from many countries have been collaborating to develop this article.

Excuse me if I made a mistake. I've never met a nobility before and I'm not trained to observe the etiquette-s. Gantuya eng (talk) 12:34, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Let's stay on topic, please. Kherlen, please also note that neither Gantuya nor myself are administrators. We are unpaid volunteer editors like you, and none of us "owes" anything to anyone. If you contribute to Wikipedia, then you must accept that people will discuss, edit, extend, or even delete your work according to their best knowledge and the relevant rules. Very few things here are the work of an individual, but usually the contributions, knowledge, and opinions of many people are combined to reach the desired result. And Gantuya, please treat your fellow editors with real respect, even if you happen to disagree with them. It is not appropriate to make fun of people's names or descent.

As to the actual question at hand: I already mentioned that the images in the top row are probably ok due to their age (most of those images are already on Wikimedia Commons, if you have them in higher quality, please contribute!).

For the rest, you need to understand some fundamental facts: The copyright to an image belongs to the photographer, not to the depicted person. In other words: It doesn't help at all if you know some model, actor, or sportsperson, because they don't have the right to give you permission for anything in this context. If you don't have written permission from the copyright owner, then it is illegal to use that picture on Wikipedia (in pretty much any legislation I'm aware of). Most of those images seem to be taken from printed publications. This means that they are made by professional photographers, and the copyright either remains with them, or they have transferred it to the publisher. Neigher of them are likely to release them for use by Wikipedia, because they earn their living from licensing fees. I still see no indication that any of the images below the first row are legal for us to use. As you have noticed, many other web sites routinely violate copyrights by showing pictures without permission. But that is no excuse for us to do the same.

In summary: If you want to upload a picture to Wikipedia or the Commons, then either the copyright must be expired, or you need the permission of the photographer. Most other questions are irrelevant. --Latebird (talk) 08:50, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

I see you now uploaded a new version. Can you name the photographers of the lower row, and present their written permission to declare them as your own work? If this isn't possible, then they will still have to be deleted. In your previous explanations, you said that they "have been running on Mongolian websites and blogs for a long long time". But that doesn't mean that they are free to use. Most likely the other sites showing them are simply breaking the law, and we must not do the same. --Latebird (talk) 14:00, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

Khalkha Picture 3

Removed off-topic discussion. This is my personal user talk page. Please discuss personal matters between each other elsewhere, and please do not SHOUT. Thanks for your understanding. --Latebird (talk) 08:14, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

The AfD page

Hello. I am unsure of the correct procedure required to nominate articles. I notice that you seem to have helped me out. I would like to say Thank You. Spoke shook (talk) 11:44, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

No problem, it has sat there long enough. --Latebird (talk) 11:46, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Batkhuyag Munguntuul

why have you moved the article to Batkhuyagiin Möngöntuul?  Dr. Loosmark  15:35, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

That is the corerct transcription according to Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Mongolian) (as explained in the edit comment "see WP:MON"). --Latebird (talk) 08:04, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I don't see anything in Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Mongolian) to justify your move. I am moving the article back.  Dr. Loosmark  12:23, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

You might want to read it again then. It clearly states that names should be transcribed from the Mongolian cyrillic original using the table provided, and even more specifically: "the full name consists of the father's name and the given name, in that sequence. The father's name is in genitive form, usually ending in -iin or -yn (eg. Peljidiin Genden).". There is no reason to ignore that rule in this case. Your repeated revert is clearly unjustified and makes it rather hard to assume godo faith. --Latebird (talk) 10:41, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Invitation to join WikiProject Deserts

WikiProject DESERTS invitation Hello Latebird! I noticed your contributions to Gobi Desert, and thought you might be interested in WikiProject Deserts, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of deserts of the world and their features. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks and related articles. Thanks! Farjad0322 (talk|contribs) 22:32, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Munguntuul Batkhuyag

Provide a source that she is known as "Batkhuyagiin Möngöntuul" in English sources. Also since you don't have consensus for your move, i believe you are required per policy to open a move request rather then just move the article.  Dr. Loosmark  10:54, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Reopening a discussion

I want to reopen the discussion Naming_conventions_(Cyrillic)#Example_convention regarding bibliographic references because I think Unicode changes the game somewhat. Since you have participated in the same talk page, I hope you will visit the discussion and give me your opinions. Thanks! LADave (talk) 23:42, 17 June 2011 (UTC)

Proposed Tibetan naming conventions

A while back, I posted a new proposal for Tibetan naming conventions, i.e. conventions that can be used to determine the most appropriate titles for articles related to the Tibetan region. This came out of discussions about article titles on Talk:Qamdo and Talk:Lhoka (Shannan) Prefecture. I hope that discussions on the proposal's talk page will lead to consensus in favour of making these conventions official, but so far only a few editors have left comments. If you would be interested in taking a look at the proposed naming conventions and giving your opinion, I would definitely appreciate it. Thanks—Nat Krause^{(Talk!·What have I done?)} 15:49, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Khalkhyn Gol

You have previously moved the article on Khalkhyn Gol. The article has been proposed for moving again, see Talk:Halh River#Requested move (again). --Stefan2 (talk) 15:22, 1 November 2011 (UTC)