Talk:Mitsubishi Delica

Confusing introduction

The introduction as I see it: The first sentence says that the Delica, the subject of this article, is a range of vans and pickups launched in 1968. The second sentence says that it was originally based on a van and pickup launched in 1967 also called the Delica, leaving me to wonder what this 1967 Delica was, where I can find information about it, and why it's not covered by this article. Then the third sentence starts "This pickup truck, and a commercial van derived from it..." and it's not clear whether 'this pickup truck' means 'the subject of this article' [the Delica from 1968 onwards] or 'the subject of the previous sentence' [the 1967 Delica] Scatterkeir (talk) 13:27, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

YouTube link justification

As per Wikipedia:External links/YouTube recommendations, justification for YouTube links now on talk page. "Links whose use have been justified on the talk page may not be be removed using automated tools. Rather the reviewing editor should only make manual removals after addressing the justification on the talk page. Subject to a single warning, the removal of such links by automated tools would be grounds for access priviledges for these tools to be removed. Such removals may be reverted on sight."

Both links were originally inserted by User:Richard Harvey at 14:35, June 11, 2006. The user has attested on WP to being the owner of multiple Delicas, and is a member of the owners' club for the vehicle. Further, he has explicitly licenced his text and image contributions under the GFDL. In these circumstances there is no obvious copyright infringement. --DeLarge 11:01, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

"Present" Production

A couple of the older models still say they are being produced presently in their box on the right. Is this true or does it need to be changed to its final year of production? Mkid1 (talk) 02:33, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

L300

Mitsubishi_L300 is 3rd gen of Mitsubishi_Delica - should we merge these 2 articles? --Galantea0 (talk) 16:01, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

No, they are different vehicles. The L300 article relates to the L300 Mini Van (see this articles lead paragraph), which is a commercial vehicle. The model designation 'Delica' was taken from the earlier L300 and given to the passenger versions of the L300's and L400's and later D5. The L300 Delica model being the 'Star Wagon. The L400 Delica a 'Space Gear' (the commercial L400 is called a 'Cargo'). Richard Harvey (talk) 15:17, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

These articles are now in the process of being merged, "Delica" being the JDM name for all (commercial and passenger) versions of these cars, with L300/L400 simply export labels used in Europe and a few other markets. Several other names are also in use for other markets. See here, here, and here (section V, p.6 or p. 18 overall).  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 19:11, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

A further facelifted version of the third generation Delica is still being sold as the L300... kind of a fork of the brand. Maybe this should be listed here Hydroksyde (talk) 10:52, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

Australia

After a chat with User:OSX (who after all lives in Australia and has photographed hundreds of cars there) I found out that Australian sold L400 (and passenger L300s) were indeed called Star Wagons there, with no mention of Delica. See this Autotrader for an example, but you could easily find plenty more. I was as surprised as anyone, but there you have it.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 18:57, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

I am working on a table for the names used in various markets. See another conversation here: OSX talk page. The Delica Space Gear you posted from youtube is simply a grey import, these are very popular in Australia. As for the pictures of JDM tailgates, they really aren't necessary and prove nothing in this context.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 19:17, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Here's an Australian site dealing mainly with Aussie market Star Wagons: [1]. I found this through the Aussie Delica forum: [2]  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 19:23, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

I am unable to see the Autotrader link, which my computer shows as 'Not Found', but there are many photo's of the L400 Delica Space Gears on the Australian Delica owners Club, some of which are owned by friends of mine that have moved to Australia and were formerly fellow members of the main UK Delica Owners club (MDOCUK.co.uk) which show the L400 to be badged as a Space Gear. I haven't seen one badged as a Star Wagon. Note this youtube entry from a Dealer in Australia which clearly labels the vehcile as a Space Gear [3]. However I am most annoyed by your instant deletion of the image I placed showing the tailgate decals of a L400 Delica Space Gear, which support the name of the vehicle. Are the Autotrader ads current sales, which may be grey imports produced by the MMC partner company in China, that MMC has curtailed, this needs to be sorted so we dont' start causing confusion. Richard Harvey (talk) 19:28, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

The tailgate images show JDM Space Gears and Star Wagons. Those mean nothing when talking about cars which were sold new in Australia. Any vehicle labelled "Delica" seen in Australia is simply a grey import. Here is another photo (I don't know why your computer won't let you see any photos, maybe you should adjust something in your settings?), of a car with VIN #JMFWA1M35RJ000535 (see here). Using a handy VIN decoder, we can read that this Starwagon was built in Japan in 1994: Decoder. The first two letters "JM" mean Japan - so no Chinese knockoffs but the official Australian market L400s.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 19:37, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

The "Australian dealer" video you posted above is shot in Japan by someone who exports these cars. The opening words in the video are: "Hello viewers! This is Nobu, live from Tokyo". The listed website is here.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 19:42, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Hmm; this is curious. With having a 'reasonable technical' knowledge of the parts used in ' Delica's ' and having looked at the Starwagon Parts company link one thing I can instantly see is that the vehicles are purely 2WD, whereas the Delica badged item comes in both 2WD and 4WD. Also there is a different engine available for them that is not used in Delica's. The first post in the Delica Club link you gave does refer to some of the parts used in those Star Wagon's as being suitable 'crossover parts' for use in Delica's. I've recognised one of the members posting on that link as someone I know, who is a club moderator. I will contact him for more detailed information on the vehicle. NB: we seem to be crossing in messages here as evertime I try to reply I get and edit conflict, where you are back on again :). Obviously we both want to be correct on this, but in the end I think we may have to again split the 'Delica Badged' items to their own article. trying to combine the Commercial L300's and L400's with the passenger item and 'look-a-like' vehicles badged as other motors is getting very confusing. Richard Harvey (talk) 19:49, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

NB: Your last revert, which you have done without concensus being agreed, has technically placed you in breach of the WP:3RR rule! Richard Harvey (talk) 19:54, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

In Australia, third generation models have been badged "Express" in commercial form since 1986 (yes, in 2011 we are still "blessed" to get these archaic steam-driven models, complete with a one-star crash rating included at no extra cost). Passenger models were sold between 1986 and 2001 as the "Starwagon" [4]. In 1994, the third generation Starwagon was complemented by a fourth generation model, which was also called "Starwagon" and remained on sale until 2003 [5]. OSX (talk • contributions) 10:27, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

See also, the South African "Ford Husky" [6], [7]. OSX (talk • contributions) 10:36, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

Is the current (3rd gen) Express built in Taiwan or Japan? Had never heard of the Husky before.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 15:27, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

I'm still waiting for a reply from my mate in Oz, apparently he has "Gone Walkabout". However here's a couple of points worth noting from the messages above. The 3rd Generation L300 is the 'Star Wagon' not a 'Starwagon' The advert link OSX has placed above may say 'Starwagon' on the title. however if you look at the two photo's, to the right of the page, showing the tailgate, there is clearly a space between the words Star and Wagon. The same error often occurs in the UK where some traders list the L400 Delica as a 'Delicia'. To see what vehicles are produced in the individual production plants worldwide, where they were exported to and if or not they are Badged or unbadged Mitsubishi vehicles see the source links I put at the bottom of the 'Production' section in the article Facts & Figures 2010. Towards the end you will see a timeline showing all vehicles produced back to the Jeep in 1953. There is a notation in that which states unbadged Delica's are produced by CMC and PMC in China. One fellow Delica owner has advised me the L400 style 'Starwagon' appears to have been produced in China, which is supported by the fact that the writing on the parts pages, shown on the starwagonparts.com website is all in Chinese and not Japanese. However the photo link, which I eventually managed to view, has the MMC logo on the tailgate! Finally:- Mr Choppers you have heard about the Ford Husky before, or at least you had in November 2008 when you edited the Samcor article to say the L300 minibus was badged as a Ford Husky! ;) Richard Harvey (talk) 08:31, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

The name "Starwagon" is used by all internet sources that I can find, including Mitsubishi Motors Australia themselves. It is possible that the 1986–2001 (as opposed to the 1994–2003 cars) models were badged "Star Wagon" but I can't find anything of interest about these models online.

Regarding the "Express", these are made in Japan. If you take a look at the various examples listed here on Carsales, you will notice the VINs start with the letter "J" for Japan (as opposed to "L" for Taiwan). OSX (talk • contributions) 09:45, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

I've just been looking through some old Mitsubishi corporate facts & figures brochures. The naming of the L300 and L400 models in various countries is shown on page 18 in the year 2000 edition, here:-[8]. That should help sort things out a bit. :) Richard Harvey (talk) 10:38, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

I am wondering now though, as the L300 variants are also used significantly n the commercial market, whilst the L400 isn't, if it would be better to split this from being a combined 'Mitsubishi Delica' article to seperate 'Mitsubishi L300' and 'Mitsubishi L400' and 'Mitsubishi Delica D:5' articles? The L300 article can be extensively enlarged with the inclusion of the commercial vehicles. Richard Harvey (talk) 10:39, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Interesting to see that I myself wrote about the Ford Husky and then forgot about it... alzheimers, I suppose. The only way to find out whether the Aussies used "Star Wagon" or "Starwagon" is to find some period marketing material. The reason Starwagonparts.com includes Chinese is because they sell Chinese-made parts that fit L400s of any sort; this is mentioned in the DelicaClub thread I linked to above. As per the Automotive project guidelines, splitting this article by generations would be premature as there is not yet nearly enough content. Commercial vehicles are already included here, as they were labelled Delica in Japan. Also, the L400 was sold as a commercial in Europe at least.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 16:14, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Names in different markets

Table of naming in different markets

Commercial versions
Generation Market	First	Second	Third	Fourth	Fifth
Japan	Delica/Delica 75/Delica 1400	Delica Truck/Cargo	Delica Truck/Cargo	Delica Cargo	"Delica Cargo" (Mazda Bongo)
General Export	Colt T100/T120	L300	L300	L400	-
Europe	Colt T100/T120	L300	L300	L400	-
North America	-	-	Van	-	-
Australia	-	Mitsubishi/Chrysler L300 Express	Express	-	-
Philippines	-	L300 Versa Van	L300 Versa Van	-	-
India	-	Mahindra Voyager	-	-	-
Indonesia	-	Colt L300 /Colt Solar	L300	-	-
Mexico	-	-	Dodge 1000	-	-
Passenger versions
Japan	Delica Coach/Delica 75 Coach	Delica Star Wagon	Delica Star Wagon	Delica Space Gear	Delica D:5
General Export	Colt T100/T120	L300	L300/Delica	Delica Space Gear	Delica D:5
Europe	?	L300	L300	Space Gear	-
North America	-	-	Wagon	-	-
Australia	-	Mitsubishi/Chrysler L300 Express	Starwagon	Starwagon	-
India	-	Mahindra Voyager	-	-	-

Now that everyone is here, would you all like to take a look at this table I have created? It's an attempt at clarifying the various names used across the world for the various generations of the Delica. Any corrections (and supporting evidence) are very welcome.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 16:26, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Did you see the link I gave above for the international names, from the Mitsubishi facts and figures book (2000 edition), where the naming of the L300 and L400 models in various countries is shown (IE this one:-[9]) on page 18? Richard Harvey (talk) 08:21, 15 April 2011 (UTC)

Trim Levels for the L300 Delica Star Wagon (passenger models) are Super Exceed - Exceed - X - XG - DX - XL - GL - GLX. For the L400 Delica Space Gear (passenger models) they are Royal Exceed - Super Exceed - Exceed - Exceed l - Exceed ll - X - XE - XR - XG and G. Some trim levels are dependent on if the vehicles are Short Wheel Base (SWB) or Long Wheel Base (LWB)See more info here:- [10]. The three top trim Levels Royal Exceed, Super Exceed and Exceed have oval badging indicating the trim ;level on the driver and front passenger door 'B' Pillars, (I have owned an Exceed and currently own a Super Exceed). Richard Harvey (talk) 22:22, 15 April 2011 (UTC)

Mitsubishi Australia themselves in 2002 called it the "Starwagon" and all other sources use this variation.

After a bit of research, I am led to believe the second generation (1980–1986) models were badged simply "L300" and came in several trim levels, the "Express", the "Wagon" and "Starwagon" [11], [12]. This television advertisement makes mention of an "Express Deluxe" model, referred as the "DL" on the cover of the Gregory's L300 repair manual. Also offered between 1980 and 1986 was an unrelated "L200 Express", a utility model based on what has now evolved into as the modern-day Triton [13]. OSX (talk • contributions) 15:13, 15 April 2011 (UTC)

So do you think that the best name would simply be L300 in both slots, or do you think L300 Express (commercial) and L300 Wagon/Starwagon (private use) is best? This is complicated by the way the lines between commercial and passenger versions are blurred in many markets.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 16:23, 15 April 2011 (UTC)

As these two videos show, "Express" is not a commercial-only designation, with the "Express", "Wagon" and "Starwagon" model names all used in reference to the passenger version. Confusingly, Mitsubishi Motors Australia often omitted the "L300" tag (as seen in the above linked advertisements), thus blurring the lines between the model names and trim levels.

Mitsubishi facts and figures (2000 edition) seems to be incorrect for Australia at least. It lists the 2000 model Delica (L300) as the "L300 Express" when it has been simply "Express" since 1986. It also lists availability of an alleged "L400 Express" in addition to the 2000 model "Star Wagon", which I highly doubt. I can not find a single reference to a commercial version of the "Starwagon" anywhere and "L400 Express" brings up nothing either. The Internet Archive version of the Mitsubishi Motors Australia website in 2000 only lists the "Express" and "Starwagon". OSX (talk • contributions) 02:49, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

I have just finished going through my 1980s motoring magazines and have uncovered a lot of good information. Firstly, I was incorrect in stating the "Express" being an L300 trim level. The model name was actually "L300 Express" and in April 1980 when introduced as the SA series, both "Van" (three-seater commercial) and "Wagon" (eight-seater) models were offered. In fact, these early models were actually badged "Chrysler L300 Express" for the first few months (I never knew this, and Google only lists one single reference to this model). Mitsubishi took over operations from Chrysler Australia in April 1980 as well, but the Australian subsidiary was not renamed until October (including all models, except the Chrysler Valiant which continued on in Chrysler form until being pensioned off the following year).

In 1981 the SB series was introduced with a luxury "L300 Express Deluxe" trim (renamed "L300 Express Starwagon" in October 1982) and in October 1983, Mitsubishi introduced the "L300 Express 4WD".

I will scan and upload copies of the articles to Flickr so we can use them as references in the next few days. OSX (talk • contributions) 15:33, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

I modified the table above to include this new information. Thanks a lot, can't wait to see the brochures!  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 17:01, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

My bad on missing the 4th gen Delica Cargo, table has been rectified to suit.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 17:48, 17 April 2011 (UTC)

Mr.choppers, here are the magazine scans as promised (albeit a bit late):

• McKay, Peter (1980). "Chrysler launches rival for Kombi" (PDF). Modern Motor. Rushcutters Bay, New South Wales: Modern Magazines (Holdings): 15. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

• Lake, Barry, ed. (1983). "More power, auto for Express wagon" (PDF). Modern Motor. Sydney, New South Wales: Murray Publishers: 13. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

• Lake, Barry, ed. (1983). "Improved L300 range" (PDF). Modern Motor. Sydney, New South Wales: Murray Publishers: 13. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

• Mills, Andrew (1984). "Mitsubishi L300 Express: The Trendsetter" (PDF). Modern Motor. Sydney, New South Wales: Australian Consolidated Press: 90–92. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

• Britten, Tim, ed. (1984). "L300 update" (PDF). Motor Manual. Melbourne, New South Wales: Newspress: 8. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

• Britten, Tim, ed. (1985). "Still king of the people movers?" (PDF). Motor Manual. Melbourne, New South Wales: Newspress: 61–62. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

Enjoy! OSX (talk • contributions) 11:47, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

I think the L300 needs its own entry. That aside, note L300s are also made by Soueast (Fujian) Motors, in mainland China, and distinguish themselves by being really ugly. It would be nice to include who makes what. For example Philippines made their own; the Dodge 1000 is made by CMC taiwan. It gets complicated. An L300 Delica in Taiwan was usually made in Taiwan, but the glass roof ones, were made in Japan (but by who?). Misbuishi made Delicas which were branded as Mazdas, but I think, the last two years Mitsubishi sold L300 Delicas in Japan, they were in fact Mazdas rebranded as Mitsubishis.Antifesto (talk) 03:29, 14 December 2012 (UTC)

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